Unedited conversations between artist in a productive critique  discovering  thesis and processes behind the work.








Kevin Arrow

Recent acquisition of the Perez Art Museum Miami


Untitled (analog/digital_5), 2013

Transparent media, Duratrans, light box

28" x 40.25" x 2.4"

ARROW:  I got hung up at OMM and then got home with an appetite so I was making vegetable curry


RAMOS:  hi


thank you for joining me


ARROW:  yep


the document i sent you is not for public consumption


RAMOS:  i understand


ARROW:  it is a doc I wrote to better understand the options for setting the piece up


RAMOS:  because the piece is a projection


ARROW:  it is rather dry and uninteresting


RAMOS:  the piece?


why do you say that?


ARROW:  the document not the WORK!




RAMOS:  haha


lets talk about the work


not the instructions


ARROW:  the work


the end product of a process which took days, weeks, months, years even


IS the end product


RAMOS:  how many different images are within that one piece


ARROW:  never thought to count them


counting would interesting but then you'd have to count the combinations of pairs of images and sets of three and so on and on


ARROW:  here's a work that I still like utilizing only one image



Kevin Arrow

the Untitled (1973) was (based on found slide)

1960s Kodak slide projector modified by engineers that worked for Eastern Airlines




ARROW: but we're discussing the PAMM piece


RAMOS:  well we are discussing you


tell me about projection as a medium


it is kind of endless


yet you are choosing to make it sort of static




ARROW:  nostalgia is what each viewer brings to the experience and his subjective


I am interested in editing and considering the variables


IS Subjective


RAMOS:  what variables?


ARROW:  oh yeah, I am interested in the different methods of display that a work may have


RAMOS:  for example?


beyond projection i mean


ARROW:  large or small


high or low


left or right


I personally am more engaged when something can be altered, adjusted, and modified.


but one thing one way is okay too


but even that will eventually give way to change


RAMOS:  as in altered during it's final viewing? or rather is it in flux as the final piece?


ARROW:  always in flux


I am doing something on Thursday evening utilizing three projectors


and three different sized screens


RAMOS:  all pointing at the same spot?


ARROW:  (160) 35mm slides and 16mm film


three screens set upon a black ornate stairway in the Moore Space


the room with the Zaha Hadid Elastic piece


RAMOS:  what will be touched by the projections?


ARROW:  touched?

RAMOS:  touched


what will be projected on?


ARROW:  I just emailed you a photo of the stairway




Kevin Arrow

Picture of Stairs at Moore Building

Miami, Florida



ARROW: ah yes


I have been free associating, editing, looking at slides, thinking about poetry


RAMOS:  because it's poetry month?


ARROW:  I am also incorporating 16mm films of Andy Warhol's screen tests from the MOMA circulating collection


yes, poetry month and it will apart of the John Giorno reading for O,Miami


so it's a small commission


RAMOS:  ahh


ARROW:  I am also integrating animated 35mm slides which I made for the occasion


RAMOS:  so wait


i'm trying to imagine this room


you said three projections


ARROW: yes three


small screen


medium screen


large screen


RAMOS:  each on a different surface?


ARROW: yes three different screens


three different projectors


and many lenses which will give me the ability to go large and small


RAMOS:  and the content within the tree projections are not related


ARROW:  yes, each on a different surface unless I choose to overlap and make layers


the content is related


related by proximity


and subject


RAMOS:  so that's not the content - that's the location


ARROW:  or not


RAMOS:  is the subject related?


ARROW:  location is content too


RAMOS:  ok i can buy that


ARROW:  everything is related


RAMOS:  everything is related


i agree


ARROW:  location








poetry recital


I have intentionally set up on the opposite side of the room from where the poets with read


and will douse the projectors during the reading


RAMOS:  will "douse" the projectors?


ARROW:  turn them off


RAMOS:  ok let me re-imagine this




RAMOS: three projections are on - until the poets begin to speak?


ARROW: correct


I am warming up the crowd


opening "act"


making a piece for O,Miami during National Poetry Month in honor of John Giorno


who incidentally is on the reel of film


I am showing his Warhol screen test from 1964


he was also the subject in the Warhol film Sleep


RAMOS:  now it is starting to make sense


ARROW:  _Sleep, _1964 premiered at the Gramercy Arts Theatre in front of an audience of nine people, only two of whom walked out.


I am not screening Sleep


but I do have a 35mm slide of a single frame from the movie


which kind of outdoes Warhol


RAMOS:  the film of Giorno sleeping for five hours


i'm sure one slide is plenty


ARROW:  I like the idea of screening one single frame from Sleep in perpetuity


RAMOS:  so do i


ARROW:  well the camera does move occasionally


RAMOS:  Andy liked to put people through painful experiences


and those can sometimes be very magical


ARROW:  well I never considered his sadistic side


RAMOS:  that's the only side i see for some reason


ARROW:  but yeah, you can talk for hours about Warhol


RAMOS:  we don't have to


so the poets


will their poems be an homage to Giorno?


ARROW:  I like to remember the Andy eating a McDonald's hamburger or appearing on the Love Boat television show.


only two poets


one of which is John Giorno


here's something about that


RAMOS:  oh wow - i didn't realize he would be there


who gets to be the other poet?


ARROW:  Ryan Van Winkle from out of town too


John Giorno performing in Miami is kind of epic


RAMOS:  yes it is


I am definitely going


ARROW:  I will be having fun


as I have been mapping out the possibilities


and cannot wait to show up and do something for a few hours


something ephemeral


Kevin Arrow

Untitled (John Giorno), 2016

(2) 35mm slide projectors (160) 35mm slides, polarized slides and 16mm Film projector, Andy Warhol Screen tests Collection of the Museum of Modern Art Circulating Film Library


Images courtesy of Institute of Contemporary Art, Miami (ICA).

Photo: Sonja Garnitschnig.